Should we scrap the Highlanders?

Chris Rattue says:"The time is right for the New Zealand Rugby Union to scrap the hopeless Highlanders and plant a new Super 14 franchise in North Harbour."

Here is the latest selection of Your Views:

Jonathan (Christchurch)
Wow what a guy this Chris dude is and what a short memory and knee jerk reactions that he has. It actually reminds me of our esteemed Prime Minister at the moment (find a tiny problem and slap a pathetic draconian law to stop it). Is this a sign of the socialist government going to his head. Possibly, but who cares his reasons the fact is he is wrong wrong wrong so plainly wrong! I like some of the comments already made about this. The first and best being give some more money to Richard Loe as he is significantly better at writing than this guy. Also I liked the comments about how they have just had a couple of bad years, give them a chance to come back. Rebuilding takes time assuming you have the right conditions. On top of that if he was as knee jerk to Auckland as he is to Otago then the other people are right, Auckland should have been lost to us all ages ago. As much as I don't like Auckland it would be a shame if Canterbury couldn't thrash them any more.

Merv, Auckland
You are Richard Head Chris. So, every time a team goes through a down patch we dump them. If this was the case Auckland cricket's one day team would never have been given a chance to recover themselves and The Crusaders would have been gone after 1 season. Get a grip man!

Steve
Get rid of the highlanders & replace them with a decent team. Who want to got to such a crappy hole like Dunedin for a rugby game. Their weather is awful & so is the rugby team. The players aren't even from Otago, they're from Auckland. Face reality and lets get a decent team to replace them. This is the 2000s not the 1800s.

Jerry (London)
I cannot believe this article has even been written. Get a grip Chris, see the world. You may not care but the 'House of Pain' is one of the best known NZ rugby grounds in the UK. The market over here is crying for quality rugby, and what Super 14 coverage we do get is quite well watched.Just like Liverpool is everyone's 2nd fav football team (after their own), The Highlanders are everyone's 2nd fav rugby team in the UK. There is an appeal to the Highlanders brand, and of any team that represents NZ's most famous and well known landscapes.This article smacks of sensationalism - to which we are very accustomed to in the tabloid ridden UK press. Hopefully Kiwi readers have learnt to disregard this journalism, as we have over here.

Murf in Sydney
What am I reading? Because Auckland has so many registered players they should have another team? If the rubbish written by the JAFAs was true then they would be like the All Blacks and have two or three deep in all positions and be able to beat the rest of us every time they play. How many times has that happened? In the history of our great game where do the real men of rugby forward strength come from? Look it up. But then again maybe we should dump any franchise that has a couple of mediocre years while they regroup. Oops..doesn't that mean Auckland would have lost its franchise. David Brown, Chris Rattue, grow up.

Viv Philli
Chris is just airing what's been on many rugby followers minds since the disappointing finishings by NZ franchises this year. I am a South African supporter of NZ rugby and the Highlanders has always been my favourites. Despite some poor performances, Otago/Southland remain icons of NZ rugby and it would be a shame to take it all away from the Southerners. Yes, the Highlanders will miss the likes of brilliant individuals like Nick Evans, Carl Hayman, Anton Oliver , Blackie, Newby etc but c'mon there must be enough talent down south to keep the fans happy at the Brook/Rugby Park and Q'town. After all the Aussies is not doing that great either and nobody is writing off any of their franchises! C'mon give the Southerners a break.

izzi
The problem is not with the franchises or where they are situated. The problem is with NZRFU owning the rights to the players. It seems we want to live in a professional environment and hold on to traditional models as well. Take for example the Soccer and the American professional sports teams. They are privately owned franchises so they go and buy the best that they can get to build a team around they invest big time in their team with in comp guidelines. Their players only have to concentrate on the team not playing for a club, a province, a super franchise, the All Blacks A B junior ABs. We see the power the English clubs wield because they own the rights to the players. If we want to see passionate crowds fill the stadiums let the franchises buy the best teams that they possibly can from all over the world instead of all of our best heading to the lucrative pastures overseas.My assessment is get rid the power the NZRFU have and make it a open market for the franchises who cares if we have 2 Aussie backs, a French lock and a South African no 8 create the best rugby comp in the world become a true professional sport. The tests this year were a farce anyway leave them to the amateurs.
Mainlander (Auckland)
I can't believe what I read in your normally high standard newspaper. It used to be one of the best. But couldn't believe what I saw in print before my eyes. A story suggesting the Highlanders be axed! What utter rubbish. I think one should question who the author, Chris Rattue is. Is he a west islander (Aussie) who aspires to Aussie Rules? Or was he becoming confused with soccer? I think his next (and last) article in your newspaper, should be an apology.

Rita Chikloa
I lived in New Zealand for 6 months and I've heard this debate all around the country, I would say that I would have to side with Auckland on this one. It is the only city in the country that I would rate as being up to standard, and have the population to support it. you can't just have a franchise in a small place for the sake of it, thats just stupid. Also I found them to be very strange people in the south island, very loud and with big egos for no reason

Johnno (Christchurch)
Gee you Aucklanders give yet another example of why you're called JAFAs...without doing the stats I can think of quite a few seasons when you guys performed less well than the Highlanders (and indeed almost everyone else. Did anyone suggest then that we do away with the Blues? Noooooo! Thats because the rest of the country understands it not all about Auckland. But maybe we should think about a revision of the draft system so avoid situation (like Rico Gear or Kevin Senio's move to Canterbury) where a team full of ABs can snaffle someone just because he has made the Abs

watto (Thailand)
I agree with Tod - scrap Chris Rattue. In fact, give Richard Loe more money for more write ups. His are worth reading. Chris writes a good heading occasionally though.And keep the highlanders, only a moron would suggest otherwise.

Dunedin
This would mean there would be no Super Cup rugby team in Dunedin, right? What a brilliant idea! Then maybe we won't need to pay for that bloody stadium. Scrap the Highlanders.

Ex-Harbour
As someone who used to live on the North Shore, Auckland has always been 'the enemy' - a team for those that live in North Harbour and Northland would be fantastic and as we have so many rugby players in New Zealand, I would be more interested in us growing to Super 15 (which would be a nice play on First 15...). As for getting rid of the Highlanders, you've got to be joking. The fans are amongst some of the most passionate and wanting to cull them because of a couple of bad seasons is pointless. Give them a real go, and let's consider expansion once again.

Rob (Auckland)
Don't know about dumping the Highlanders, but should add a new franchise in the north and re-organise the Blues/Chiefs:North with Northland & North Harbour, Blues with Auckland & Counties. Chiefs with Waikato & BOP/ This would allow the talent from Harbour and Auckland to play locally without relocating through the draft (propping up) the other NZ franchises. Each of the three major Unions would have smaller Union in which they would have to invest and develop players for the benefit of their S14 franchise.

Chris (North Harbour)
Kids, kids, nobody is suggesting we do away with the proud heritage of Otago rugby - simply that we pull away their Super 14 franchise. The Otago NPC team can continue to pump out these mountain men forwards, and lame duck backs, and if they're of value they can enter the draft. Why have our largest player catchment area represented by only one team? Think of the Auckland based players who have had to leave town to play S14 rugby elsewhere. Do you think Evans and Newby would have moved to Dunedin if they could play their perferred positions in a local Auckland-based team? It shouldn't be about crowd numbers, performance in the weakest S14/12 to date, or an even geographic spread - it should be about what is best for the future of NZ rugby... and that isn't holding on to the past in Dunedin.

Cynbin (Christchurch)
I would hate to see the Highlanders dropped from the Super 14 competition. But the way the franchise is being run has been developing speed wobbles for a long time.My idea is let Invercargill take the Highlanders franchise over, I am sure they would change their fortunes around, just look what Netball Southland did with the Sting. Ten years in the final of the National Bank Cup and with out of this world crowd support. But if the Highlanders were to lose their franchise for goodness sake don't bother giving it to North Harbour, they would be the New Highlanders and would struggle. All the best players are with the Blues franchise, sure Harbour won the Ranfurly Shield but that was due to apathy on Canterbury's part. But have they won a major competition? I don't think so.

Tod Tait
Should we scrap Chris Rattue? Chris who? The time is right for the New Zealand Herald to scrap the hopeless Chris someone and plant a new and capable sports reporter in Auckland.How long is the Herald going to put up with its ball and chain? Chris whathisname is taking up oxygen, blocking the chance of Ruby the local chimpanzee who would surely be more capable of documenting an original piece of sports journalism for our pages.This is the man who delivered the most ridiculous line in the history of New Zealand rugby when he claimed "sorry, but Wales are rubbish".Who's rubbish (I forgot your name again)?These words were an ill-considered sop to the rugby heart, delivered by a brain not fully engaged....

Vince Kuo
Heritage and legacy is something you can not buy or measured. In this instance, I would still support the Super Rugby franchise be retained in Dunedin. However, in a more contractive manner, a partnership approach could be formed between OFU and NHRFU, which will guarantee certain amount of NH players to play for the Highlanders, and in return the Highlanders will play 2-3 home games at NH stadium. span>

Sam (Sydney)
OK so Otago only finished in front of 50 per cent of the Australian teams and 66 per cent of the South African teams and level on points with Wellington. May be there were two or three players from outside the region but then that is less than any other franchise in NZ, from memory Wellington had 11 in the wider squad. No Chris is just trying to wind up the public, of course someone has to finish last equal amongst the NZ teams. He knows New Zealand needs an Otago to teach other fancises how to ruck and maul, 66 per cent of the starting front row line up against SA will be Otago, 80 per cent of the tight five for the Junior AB's against Australia A last week learnt their trade in the Highlanders franchise region. Here's what is needed, extend the concept and have promotion relegation say a Super 12 A and Super 12 B, this year NSW and the Reds could play off against the top of Super 12 B. May be that would be Samoa, Canada, Japan or an Argentinian Club side. Better still allow England, Wales, Scotland etc to play Super 12 (England might even finish mid table).

Adam
The North Harbour highlanders is not a new idea. It's been around for sometime and it's never seriously been considered. It seems that whenever the highlanders have a poor season, the vultures circle. I remember in 1997 someone wanted to scrap the Highlanders and have a new franchise in the islands. The problem for North Harbour is that they are a square peg. No one wants them, the chiefs didn't and the blues don't. North Harbour needs to address the real problem which is under representation in the Blues franchise. Maybe they should demand a 50-50 quota of players. Also, this year only one of seven home games was played on the shore. If you can't organise 3 or 4 home games for yourself, why should you be trusted with the Highlanders franchise?

David Brown
I totally agree with the dumping of the Highlanders in favour of a north Auckland team. It's about time that the NZRFU catered to the player base rather than on the sentiment of a pack of goat herders down in some forgotten backwaters at the end of the earth. The fact is that the Highlanders would have to get their aunties to pull on a jumper just to fill a team list if it wasn't for the draft.Auckland has 25000 registered players, North Auckland 16000 registered players and Otago has 1200, it's time to put these big mouth dim wits from the south in perspective. No player should have to be forcibly drafted down to that pathetic little place.

Truerugby
It looks like Chris must have had a deadline coming up and nothing to write about, I mean with all the rugby going on at the moment around the world surely Chris could have come up with something better then this. I mean Tri nations, Weak NH sides touring, NH teams who think club rugby is more important than tests, the Pacific Nations Cup, the Nations Cup, and a little matter called the World Cup. But I just like rugby, just think he could write about from this lot. If nothing comes to mind then "Please Chris's boss" I'm looking for a job to report about the best sport in the world. And Arron "Who cares as the Highlanders (and for that matter the Chiefs, and to a slightly lesser extent the Crusaders) is made up of predominantly Auckland players anyway." Last count there were 4 Auckland Players Born and Breed in Chiefs team, 4 from 32 Predominantly? I think not.

Kiwi living in Ireland
Pull your Auckland head there, do you realise life exists past the Bombays? Taking the franchise away from the Highlanders would slowly kill off professional rugby in the south.None of the Super franchises has complete 100 per cent talent from their provider unions, that hasn't been brought from a weaker province. So maybe the Highlanders need to seriously look at their selection policies.Creating another franchise through North Harbour is not in the best for Harbour /Auckland rugby, not NZ rugby.

Ross (Berlin)
It is debatable if Chris Rattue is capable of clear thinking; it is obvious he can't count. Not even small numbers. In competitions like the Super 14 or RWC it is who makes it to the business end that counts. In the fullness of time no-one gives a monkeys where you ended up on the table - if you didn't make the semis you failed. Let's count up Chris (fingers ready now): the Highlanders have made the semis three times and the final once, the same record as the Hurricanes. The Chiefs have made only one semi. Based on any criteria other than Chris' 'logic', it would be the Chiefs we dump. And as for comparisons with North Harbour: they have never won the NPC, while Otago has won it twice to Waikato's single victory. As populist nonsense for a northern audience your idea may seem clever Chris, but it is just that, nonsense.

Brendan (Wellington)
As a Wellington & Hurricanes fan, I feel we need the Highlanders in the Super 14, to keep a geographical spread across NZ. Otago has produced some great all blacks & generally play an attractive expansive game, which is great to watch & I wouldn't want to lose that. The greater Auckland region doesn't need two sides when the Chiefs are just down the road & the Blues fans should be happy with a strong Super 14 side. The draft system keeps the likes of the Highlanders competitive & aren't they planning a new stadium.I wouldn't want the Hurricanes sent packing after a couple of average years.Highlanders to stay!

Familyman
Should the Highlanders be scrapped??? A ridiculous statement and laughable suggestion. The Highlanders are the third best performing franchise since the commencement of Super rugby (based on Win/Loss record) behind the Crusaders and Blues. If any team should be scrapped it is the Chiefs who have never achieved in the competition going from one season of mediocrity to another. I assume the writer also believes the Warriors should also be scrapped, perhaps this too could move to Wellington like the football team.

Rattus (Bay of Plenty)
I half agree with Chris. Dump the Highlanders, they are poos.But dont replace them .

Hamish (Dunedin)
Chris obviously had a slow day but had to write something, but to suggest getting rid of the highlanders is insane. I remember when the Chiefs were right near the bottom of the super rugby comp, was he calling for them to be axed then? The Highlanders have been original in recruiting players locally, this should be applauded. If the Blues had to grow its own players i.e no island imports, I am sure it would be near the bottom of the super14.The Higlanders will grow & emerge a force to be reckoned with again.But I do think the last placed New Zealand team should play a promotion/ relegation series of best of 5 against any team that wishes to challenge. Imagine a super 14 competition without an Auckland team, if even for only one year how great it would be!

Colin (London)
Mr Rattue's observations re Otago are spot on. Otago simply doesn't have the player numbers, commercial support, or fan base to justify their privileged place as one of the 5 "super unions". As a Harbour fan, I'd love it if Harbour became the 5th super union. However I don't think that would work, particularly in the short term. Having 2 franchises in the Auckland region is viable commercially, but the Auckland viewing public are unlikely to turn out in enough numbers to justify having 2 teams. Particularly if one of those teams is Harbour, which has in recent times had poor gate numbers.In reality, there are only 2 regions strong enough in all facets to justify a team - Auckland and Canterbury. In addition, Wellington and Waikato have consistently good crowds.My suggestion is we have between 2 and 4 unions with a guaranteed super 14 spot, and the remaining 1-3 teams get chosen on the basis of results in the preceding NPC. That would create real interest in the NPC, and surely if fans know that each year may be their last year in the super 14 for a while, they'll turn out in numbers. Top up their players from the super 14 draft, and away you go!

Wakatipu Bill
Quite obviously Chris Rattue is a born and bred Jafa - one would expect nothing less on their viewpoints regarding the Highlanders- I am a supporter of the Highlanders and they will come again. You hear many comments on crowd attendance at the Brook. Just go back on your records to ascertain attendance numbers at Eden Park & North Harbour. In excess of 10 per cent of Highlander supporters attend their home games - If you apply the same percentage to the Blues Auckland would need a stadium holding 100,000 - enough said.

Eggs, Southerner based in Auckland
The deep south is a nurturing ground for players that possess all the qualities of great All Blacks and New Zealanders: mental toughness, physical presence, leadership, and mana. Recent notable examples include the current captain McCaw (Otago Boys High School), B.Keller (Otago Boys High School), A.Hore (John McGlashan, Dunedin) Tom Willis (Kings High, Dunedin)and the man mountain Carl Hayman (Kings High School, Dunedin) The region may not produce the quantity of talent as other regions do but the players that they do produce are often the backbone of our national sides. Talent does not always make you a champion, I have watched on as many "talented" players wilt under the pressure of rugby's professional ara. The deep south breeds grit and determination, two attributes that will keep us at the top of world rugby in the professional era. Without a super 14 side to aspire to these players would not be where they are today.The NZRFU should be doing more to support, nurture and retain players in the Otago and Southland regions.
Even in a time of turmoil for Otago rugby they consistently place higher than their Harbour counterparts.

Tristin (Dunedin)
Damn Chris, u should start writing for the woman's weekly or similar, sensationalist journalism at it's best.. Otago has a pretty good record in the super 12/14. Sure the last few years have been pretty lousy.But I am sure Otago's not the only franchise to have a lull in form. I think a change in draft strategy now that Gray has gone is the best thing for the Highlanders in the future. We have the smallest player pool in the country, it was foolish to think we could just use local talent.

Nigel
If they don't build the new stadium and demonstrate a serious willingness to turn things around then I think it's a franchise on borrowed time. My personal hope is that these sorts of articles will wake them up & make things happen. I'd prefer 6 New Zealand teams ( add Harbour ) and a two tier / two side draw for Super 16 with the other additional team from Canada or USA.

Richard
Get of the grass, if you care to look the Hurricanes and the Highlanders and one other team from memory all ended up with the same number of points at the end of the competition. The only difference was the points differential so why not the Hurricanes franchise going west? You are the second journalist with similar comments I have seen. Open both eyes.

Bruce
No. Teams go through good times and bad. The Highlanders as a professional franchise are positioned in the deep south to take the S14 to that part of our land. It's not about growing players. The truth is few of the 5-franchises field a majority of their own home grown players. No one really cars, just that they have a team they can identify with.North Harbour people have the Blues to support and should do so. North Harbour incidentally was also supposed to be the home of New Zealand Football (soccer) and look what happened there as a consequence of very poor support and attendances! I suspect that if Dunedin builds the country's first indoor rugby stadium as planned then the Highlanders will enjoy the sort of crowd support Wellington does. Auckland based teams don't offer the country anything more or less than what's already out there, and certainly nothing like Otago are planning in time for 2011. Nice little ruffle the feathers article though!

Richard (Hong Kong)
In reality Otago and Southland deserve a Super14 franchise in the same way Waikato and BoP do. In practical terms it is not a step in the right direction for NZ rugby. Over the past 20 years, The Otago RFU has done an appalling job building any kind of player depth or player academy to attract and retain good talent down there. I see little reason to support a union so short of vision and so caught up in irrelevant history. There should be 1 franchise for the entire South Island. That way proper competition for places would emerge and the 7-8 worthy Otago and Southland players would get rewarded each year. The NZRFU must continue to build depth where player numbers are highest and coaching resources at their greatest. Sorry Otago, you had your chance - and squandered it through all your petty local politics.

Nick
Thank you to Norman F for yet again proving that the attitudes of those south of the Bombays are the ones that should be questioned and not the other way round. His comments are not at all objective as he has asked the journalist to be. Perhaps if he looked at the facts that the whole of the South Island has only about 23 per cent of our entire population he could then ask himself why does it get 40 per cent of our Super 14 teams. Good on you Chris for making an informed comment on what is best for Rugby in New Zealand not just the South Island.

Warren Lee
Obviously a very slow week for rugby if this is the best Chris Rattue can come up with. That the region does not have the depth of players is evident by the fact that the Blues despite promising to deliver every year have apart from once or twice managed to disappoint at the business end. Was Chris calling for a move of the franchise over the bridge when Auckland were not only bad but a sorry sight? No each year he looked at the positives and said we will win - it was said again this year again until the wheels fell off. Otago and Southland are proud and strong rugby provinces steeped in tradition with the ability to produce players of outstanding quality; Goldy, Frank Oliver, Laurie Mains, Paul Henderson, the Hazletts,etc etc. It has also thrown up in this season an answer to what may be described as a lack of depth in the locking pool with Tom Donnelly and Hoani MacDonald. My suggestion Chris, get real and leave the South alone and before it gets personal; no I am not from Highlanders country.

Rosco
Chris, clearly you have little knowledge of the passion, heart and guts possessed by the rugby/general public of the south. While it may seem like a bit of fun firing cheap shots from the safety of your penthouse in Dork-land, rest assured, with a brain dead comment like that you have officially signed off on your sports journalism carreer - and I wouldn't even contemplate heading south for a holiday any time in the next, say, 30 to 40 years.... even then, you'd be pushin it. You're about as bright as old Holmes when in one sentence he destroyed 20 years of hard earned credibility... you've been a "cheeky aucklander" mate.

GoBlacks
I think scrapping the Highlanders in favour of a Habour franchise is a great idea. Especially in the modern era with less concern for geographical and sentimental factors. The fact is the Auckland and Habour region produce more talent than any other region by far, whilst Otago is the opposite. Gear, Senio, David Smith, Tipoki, Evans, Mika, Ward, Toeava, Toeava, Lavea, Blackie, Pisi are a few of the examples of people who have had to leave the Harbour/Auckland region in the last few years a there is not enough space in the Blues for them. Apart from Oliver and Hayman, Otago hasnt had any decent players that have orignated from Otago. Every year the players picked from the draft are mostly from Auckland. Why should other regions get commercial success from auckland products? Gear, Laulala, Senio, Tuiali'i, Ralph, Filipo are further examples of guys who would much rather stay in the north island but due to there being too much talent have to help out the inadequacies of south island teams. Bring on the Harbour super 14 team I say!

Compost (Auckland)
Chris Rattue once again shows his poor knowledge of the game and if he cared to look at the statistics over the last 10 years he will see that the Highlanders have been the 3rd best performing team over this period.If you were to use his argument you would also transfer the franchise for the Hurricanes who have also been a poor performer this year.Lets not pretend the Highlanders don't have issues - they certainly do - but a change of leadership within the franchise and finding a coach that can actually coach would be a good start to rectifying the problem.Please don't condemn me to become a Crusaders supporter that would be too cruel.

Ozago Boy

I can only assume that Chris was desperate for a subject - or wants to create some comment for a future article. But I will bite anyway.First, the commercial view - as an Aussie import (I blame my parents!) I can give you the outsiders view: Carisbrook is perhaps the most iconic stadium in world rugby - taking it and its team away from the "glamour event" will weaken the "brand" and in the end affect everyone.Second, the rugby view - North Harbour will have similar problems and dilute the JAFA pool a la Australia.Third, the southern view - our most unreliable players have been from the North! Nick Evans being the exception...but how often did he actually play? So what is wrong with taking the longer view and developing local talent? Yes we will suffer in the short term but in the longer term we will be stronger for it! Fourth, the exodus view haven't you seen the Speights ads - Otago and Southland are veritable forward factories! And at least our guys are good enough to chase the big money!

Dazl
Rattue, once again you only look at one side of the story... do you really want to give the Crusaders the entire South Island as a catchment area? Imagine if the Highlanders had not existed this year - in addition to the players they already had, they would also have had first dibs on Hayman, Oliver, Dermody, Ryan, Blackie, Newby, Hoani MacDonald, Cowan and Evans. And the logistics f