Late cuts: Of Grizz, The Needle, J. J. and others in the hot seat

The future of All Blacks coaches Wayne Smith and Tony Gilbert has occupied a fair chunk of sports followers' minds this week.

As punk rock heroes The Clash would have put it: should they stay or should they go?

As a high-powered panel of rugby men tackled that question this week, we pondered some of the curiosities of New Zealand sport's most-debated job: All Blacks coach ...

* When Alex Wyllie took the All Blacks to Britain in 1989, his second year in the job, he became the first person to have his official designation "coach." Until then, "Grizz" the coach had officially been called "assistant manager" or sometimes "assistant manager/coach."

* For all their proud rugby tradition, Waikato have had just one All Blacks coach. Dick Everest was in charge of the team to Australia in 1957.

* The All Blacks have won 253 of their 353 tests. That equates to a 71.7 per cent winning record, comfortably the top of all nations. The encumbents, Smith and Gilbert, have won 12 of their 17, or 70.6 per cent. If the All Blacks, under them, win in Ireland, Scotland and Argentina at the end of the year, Smith and Gilbert can boast a 75 per cent success rate.

* The late Jack Gleeson had a hand in two of the more memorable - for different reasons - All Blacks coaching initiatives during his term in charge in the mid-late 1970s. He was coach against the 1977 Lions when, during the fourth test and with the scrum in big trouble, the All Blacks packed down a furiously-backpedalling three-man scrum - just once - on their way to a series-clinching 10-9 win at Eden Park. Three months later, Gleeson's All Blacks ran France off the Parc des Princes in Paris in an outstanding tactical display to square the series.

* When John "J. J." Stewart took charge of the All Blacks in 1974 it signalled one of the biggest cleanouts of players. Of the 25 players taken to Australia, 15 were new All Blacks. One of the 15, Wellington's loose forward Andy Leslie, was named captain and held the job for three years.

* The most successful All Blacks coach is Fred Allen - or is he? "The Needle" was in charge from 1966 until 1968. In that time, the All Blacks won all 14 tests they played. The closest call was the controversial late penalty try by which they beat Australia 19-18 in Brisbane, 1968.

But what about Neil McPhail, who was coach from 1961 until 1965? In that time - excluding two tests in 1962 when he did not tour Australia - the All Blacks won 17 of their 20 tests, losing one to Australia in 1964 and one to South Africa the following year and having one draw with Scotland in 1963-64.

* Contrast the All Blacks' tours to Britain and France in 1924 and 1935-36 with the Lions and All Blacks of this year. In 1924, the Invincibles played 32 matches with 29 players and a manager. Jack Manchester's side 11 years later played 30 games with the same numbers. The captains and senior players did the bulk of the coaching. The Lions in Australia used 43 players in 10 games, and had a minimum of 15 off-field staff, while the All Blacks will take 36 players and nine off-field support staff for just five games on their tour at the end of the year.

* When former All Blacks captain Bob Stuart was pictured in the official All Blacks photograph for the 1956 series against South Africa, he was the first to appear with the word "coach" under his name.