Cabinet Minister Kiri Allan says she has never had a formal complaint made against her by any staff member. Video / Mark Mitchell
Cabinet Minister Kiri Allan has come out swinging, accusing the National Party of a “fishing” exercise that has come up empty in its search for any improper behaviour.
Allan is the subject of “concerns”, raised over a year ago by the Department of Conservation (DoC), about her working relationships that played a role in a DoC staffer ending their secondment early.
Allan said she knew nothing more about the DoC concerns other than what had been reported, adding that she wasn’t a tough boss, but a fair one who never shouted at staff.
Asked about any concerns raised by other Government departments, including the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment (MBIE), she said: ”I’ve never, ever had any allegations put to me that I’ve had to deal with on a staffing front - none.”
Tensions became heated at a select committee hearing this morning, when National MP Simeon Brown sought to shed light on a text message between MBIE officials, on March 10 this year, about Allan’s conduct.
The text fell within the scope of Brown’s Official Information Act request, which asked for material that referenced Allan’s behaviour or conduct. But the content of the text was withheld under the clause protecting “free and frank expression” between officials. Brown has appealed to the Ombudsman.
At the hearing, Brown asked questions about the text to MBIE chief executive Carolyn Tremain, who said it was a message between her and Robert Piguo, the head of Kānoa, MBIE’s regional economic development unit.
Tremain said it related to an event that had occurred that day, which was in Taranaki, and which Allan had attended as Regional Development Minister.
Further questioning from Brown was ruled out of order, but Allan, seated next to Tremain, stepped in.
“I understand there has been a fishing exercise undertaken by some members. I understand that that story’s been shopped about for some time.”
But Allan said she wanted to talk about Government support for the regions.
“This isn’t a bloodsport for most of us. This has real-life implications and consequences in real-life places like the regions I represent - Te Tairāwhiti - which have been absolutely decimated recently.
“So, Mr Brown, when you’re ready, you’ve heard from my CEO. You’re welcome to hear from the head of Kānoa as well. You have OIA’d everything under the sun, and you’ve still yet to churn anything out.”
National MP Simeon Brown has submitted a number of Official Information Act requests about Kiri Allan's conduct. Photo / Alex Cairns
After the hearing, Brown said there were still questions Allan had left unanswered.
“I think there’s certainly been some relationship issues in her office in relation to how she has been treating staff ... Ultimately, she needs to answer whether that’s been resolved or not.”
He disagreed with her “bloodsport” description.
“The reality here is there have been serious, serious issues raised. Senior public officials have felt the need to raise that. We wouldn’t be doing our job if we didn’t ask questions as well.”
Brown told the Herald his OIA request also yielded material about the working relationship between Allan and the National Emergency Management Agency, but the nature and date of the material were also withheld.
A key part of the issue is what is being talked about. Brown referred to issues, complaints and concerns that were raised. Labour has mainly kept to the line that no formal complaints have been laid.
“No formal allegations were made,” Acting Prime Minister Carmel Sepuloni said.
“Sometimes there are working relationship issues - that’s normal in any workplace ... that’s very different than a formal complaint.
“There are often workplace issues that aren’t necessarily bullying or they don’t lead to formal complaints. It could just be that there are issues with how people work together.”
Acting Prime Minister Carmel Sepuloni says working relationship issues are not unusual for any workplace. Photo / Mark Mitchell
Sepuloni said it was important to distinguish between formal complaints and “hearsay or rumour, or even just a few issues between individuals and the minister [that are] not necessarily an elevated level of issues”.
“One of the things that’s been raised is about private secs [secretaries] leaving secondments early or something. That happens quite often for a number of reasons.
“One of the reports that I saw was from one CE saying that sometimes they had robust conversations and that they weren’t always enjoyable. I think that’s quite normal for a minister’s office.”
Questioned about matters before the select committee hearing, Allan stuck to the line that no formal complaints or allegations have been laid.
Asked about the DoC “concerns”, as described yesterday by DoC director-general Penny Nelson, who raised them with Ministerial Services, Allan said: “That’s not what I have before me. That’s not the details that have been raised with me. There have never been formal allegations put to me.”
She said she had not been told of concerns about staff with any Government department heads, she said.
Where there were staffing challenges, though, she said she looked to the heads of public service departments “to help me get to better outcomes”.
She referenced National’s OIA requests, saying they reflected her willingness to ask for help when she needed it, including in her interactions with public service leaders.
Derek Cheng is a political reporter for the Herald and has worked in the Press Gallery in Parliament for several years, covering the Helen Clark, John Key, and Jacinda Ardern governments.
