Open slather on phone chat

By JAMES GARDINER

Children are being lured into explicit sex and drug conversations on telephone chatlines that go unmonitored, despite material that could put them outside the law.

While public alarm grows at the risks young people take by calling such chatlines, Telecom says it cannot control what people say to each other on telephone dating services.

Police believe too little is being done to control and monitor telephone chatlines and protect children from adults looking for sex.

Lower Hutt schoolgirl Yasmin Ingrey, 13, was returned to her parents this week after being on the run for 11 days in the company of two adult men.

She sneaked out of her parents' Petone home to see a man she met on the Hot Gossip telephone dating service.

Hot Gossip is one of many similar services, including 0900 phone sex lines, where callers can pay several dollars a minute or in lump sums on their credit cards to talk either with groups of people or one-on-one.

Phone sex, while apparently illegal in New Zealand, seems to be proliferating, as advertisements mushroom in newspapers, magazines and on late-night television.

Herald inquiries found that there is often little distinction between what is talked about on phone sex lines and what many people talk about - or want to talk about - on chatlines.

A Herald reporter, posing as an 18-year-old under a pseudonym, left a message on the Hot Gossip chatline describing herself and saying she was "looking for some fun".

Within 10 minutes she had as many messages, some of them sexually explicit and some with drug references.

Sergeant Steve O'Connor, who helped head the hunt for Yasmin, said he was worried the owners of such chatlines were not only hard to identify, there seemed to be little or no check on who was using the service or what they were doing.

"As a police officer I have a concern about any adult environment that has no controls or checks that has got children accessing it," Mr O'Connor said.

"This chatline is an adult environment. It is not an environment that is safe or healthy for children to have easy access to."

Easy access is what Hot Gossip emphasises. It offers toll-free numbers in Auckland and Wellington, although callers are soon told that to continue they will have to give credit card details or dial an 0900 number and pay 33c a minute.

Some of the lines offer female callers free chat time but men have to pay.

Callers are told they must hang up if they are not 18 or over and "mature" behaviour is expected of them.

Yasmin's father, Mark, asked this week: "What 13-year-old is going to be turned off by that?"

A day before his daughter was found, Mr Ingrey, who said he was "sick with worry", called on dating chatlines to stop preying on children. He said they should all be 0900 numbers so parents would at least have the option to toll-bar them.

But even that might not solve the problem. Liz Butterfield, of the Internet Safety Group, said education programmes set up to warn children of the dangers of on-line chat rooms had quickly been expanded to cover telecommunications when the problem was identified.

And many children could access those through mobile phones, where they could call or text-message into similar chatrooms or lines.

She said a survey of 11 to 19-year-olds last year found 46 per cent had their own mobile phones and 25 per cent of them used them to interact with people they did not know.

"Internet accessing with mobile phones with cameras are presenting a lot of dilemmas," Ms Butterfield said.

Mr O'Connor: "Just in terms of who polices these things, the telephone companies don't seem to have any power to do so. Anybody can sign up a telephone ... then hook in a PABX system and configure that how you wish."

Hot Gossip management were not talking. Telecom has the client listed as Dave Morgan of Christchurch but his phone number (03-365-6688) appears to be a call centre itself, where staff said he would not be interviewed.

The company name he has listed with Telecom is not a registered business and many of the other 0900 subscribers appear to have given Telecom false or misleading names and contact details. Others are registered to overseas companies.

Telecom will make public details of the owners of all 0900 and 0800 numbers on request.

Skyecloud Pty Ltd, which runs Phone Cafe here and in Australia, defended the service. Marketing manager Andrew Dann said in the case of a 13-year-old girl it was easy to blame the telephone chatline.

"A telephone becomes an easy target because everyone's got one in their house, but it's usually indicative of much bigger problems."

Mr Dann said his company screened incoming calls for people who were obviously underage, abusive or using obscene language, but after that callers were left alone.

Telecom spokesman Andrew Bristol said they received about two complaints a month on the content of 0900 numbers and some had been taken off the network, but most complaints were about the size of bills or whether such calls had been made.

Section 113 of the Telecommunications Act forbids phone calls of an indecent or obscene nature for financial gain, which seems to suggest all telephone sex lines could be illegal, and possibly some chat groups.

David King, of the Economic Development Ministry, which administers the act, agreed that section was specifically aimed at phone sex lines, yet "a cursory look at what's on television would suggest you can ring up and get phone sex".

Mr King said a prosecution would require a complaint to police.

Mr Bristol said Telecom's 0900 policy prohibited material of a sexual nature, but the company could not be held responsible for material unless it was pre-recorded.

"We can't control what people say to each other on the phone at all."

The Herald found a series of pre-recorded sex conversations on an 0900 number, advertised variously as "Girls talk dirty" and "Ladies talk sexy", which cost $4.99 a minute.

A recorded voice warns callers they must be the bill-payer and aged 18 or over, but no attempt is made to verify that before callers get the options of hearing from "college girl Suzie", "Busty Debbie" or "Cindy the cheerleader".

Another toll-free number got a real woman, who said her "hottest, wildest" phone sex could be paid for either by credit card, ringing an 0900 number or depositing $20 into her TAB account.

They all want one thing


"Emma", a 39-year-old mother of two, recently set up an 0900 phone sex line after her clairvoyant business began to dry up.

She said no-one obviously underage had called. Most of the men were "professional, well spoken".

"I've just rubbed oil on my breasts," was her opening line for the Herald call. "What are you doing?"

Emma said she had "learned" to say what she thinks men want to hear. When she had asked what they wanted, men hung up on her.

"Most of them, you have to take charge."

Calls to Emma cost $4.99 a minute. Most are over within two.

Emma agreed with monitoring chatlines more closely: "I've rung chat lines and they all want sex and they all talk sex."

Sex, drugs and corny lines


Ten minutes and as many responses. Here's a sample of what our young phone caller found.

Herald reporter: "My name's Adele. I've got brown hair, brown eyes, size eight, just at work and I'm a bit bored. Just wanted to see what people were up to."

First caller: "How's the night working going? This is T here, I'm in central Wellington just chilling out. I've got black hair and brown eyes. Love to have a chat.

2nd caller: "Hey man, two guys from the Hutt, keen on hooking up, hitting the piss, hitting the drugs, whatever. Keen on going for a cruise, sweet as."

3rd caller: "Hey there Adele, tell me what's your favourite position and what's your sexiest outfit. Get back. Don't be shy."

4th caller: "It's Grant here, I'm 35 years old calling from Paraparaumu. You're at work are you? That's no good. Mmmm, so why did you call the g-line for - to have a horny conversation? Maybe meet someone?"

5th caller: "Call me, Horny Boy, on 52 ... for a chat."

6th caller: "Hey Adele, you sound pretty cool, I wouldn't mind having a chat to you. Where abouts are you calling from? I'm a bit older, I'm 23 so if that bothers you, sweet as, so call back."

7th caller: "Just wondering where you're working, you sound really lovely and a pretty sexy woman. My name's Voodoo, I'm good looking, 6 foot 4, green eyes, quite olive skin and looking for a fun chat tonight."

8th caller: "What are you looking for in line tonight. You sound beautiful. If you're interested in meeting up for no-strings attached and a lot of fun, get on back."

Adele: What do you mean by fun?

8th caller: "I mean you come around here, I make mad passionate love to you until you want me to stop and then you leave. And you don't have to worry about me hassling you or anything like that, but if you'd like to come round and do it again - for sure."

9th caller: "Would you be keen on meeting up tonight for some no-strings fun? I'm calling from the Hutt. We could meet up and have a smoke."