By RNZ
Former Prime Minister Sir John Key says it is pragmatic for National leader Christopher Luxon to not rule out working with New Zealand First’s Winston Peters, despite having done the same himself in the past.
Luxon said today that he would work with New Zealand First if the election results demanded it to form a government.
Key said it was a wise strategy by Luxon based on simple maths.
“The simple reality is you need 61 votes to form a government and I don’t think anybody really knows how those numbers play out on election night,” Key told Checkpoint.
“There’s a very high expectation from New Zealanders that if you have the largest majority ... then you’ll do everything you can to put together a government that stops the voters going back and having another election.”
Recent polls have New Zealand First cracking the 5 per cent threshold needed to get back into Parliament.
Key famously ruled Peters out as a coalition partner at two elections and NZ First has not gone with National into government in 27 years.
Luxon’s announcement could be seen as a way of trying to ensure National and the Act Party get enough votes to avoid New Zealand First being a factor.
“I think that he’s absolutely saying that this is a change election and if you want the country heading in a different direction when it comes to law and order and the economy and health and education then you need to make that change. The best way to make that happen is for a strong National Party.
“Now in his perfect world .. that would be 51 per cent.
“Do any of us think National’s going to poll 51 per cent on election night, probably not.”
When Key ruled out Peters in previous elections, he said he didn’t want to be involved in a “soap opera”.
Asked if he thinks Peters has changed, Key said he did not know.
“But what I can tell you is this. Having had Labour rule him out... if I was advising Christopher Luxon today about what he should do, I would advise him to rule Winston in under the conditions he’s done.
“And the reason for that is that fundamentally if you got to Election Sunday, the day after the election, and the only alternative was another election because no one would ring Winston, I think the public would be pretty grumpy.”
Key said he viewed Luxon’s decision “as an attempt to be honest, if I’m really frank”.
Ruling a party out does not mean they will not get the votes anyway, he noted.
“The problem you’ve got is that just because you rule them out doesn’t mean that 5 per cent of people don’t vote for them.
The two big political parties, National and Labour, are not polling really big numbers, he said, which opens up the field for smaller parties to have more influence.
“The problem you’ve got is you’ve got a lot of vote splitting happening. And I don’t think anyone can rule out that Winston doesn’t get 5 per cent.”
Key said he talks to Luxon regularly but did not advise on this specific decision.
“Put it this way. I can count to 61. And whether you like it or not, politics is an ugly business, sometimes, and it’s a race to 61.”
Key did work with the then-Māori Party in partnership, but Luxon has himself ruled them out.
Key said he had good relationships with the party’s then-leaders, but things have changed.
“I just think this current Māori Party are quite a different beast than they were in my day.”
“I think this current Te Pāti Maori is a little bit different... I don’t think they want to be part of that mainstream kind of thinking.”
key said he simply could not predict the election outcome, or whether Peters will once again be the kingmaker.
“Simple facts of life are, none of us are fortune tellers.”
Labour’s Chris Hipkins has ruled out working with Peters. If he changed his mind, it would be a disaster, Key thinks.
“That would be a terrible way to start a government, basically to lie to the New Zealand public.”
Asked specifically whether or not people can trust Peters, Key chuckled and said, “Hope so!”
Charlie gets confused about what month it is and has short-term memory loss.