Covid-19 coronavirus: Epidemic Committee to probe Government's economic Ministers

The Government's key economic Ministers, including the Ministers of Finance, Revenue and Small Business, will appear before the Epidemic Committee this morning.

Their appearance comes a day after Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern announced the Government was extending the level 4 lockdown until next week.

On 11:59pm next Monday, New Zealand will go into level 3 for at least two weeks.

Finance Minister Grant Robertson said "many many firms" have contacted the Government to say the wage subsidy scheme is "giving them hope".

Although staying in level 4 longer will hurt businesses, it's better than the alternative, which is having to go back into level 4 after being in level 3.

"Doing it once, and doing it right is best for the economy."

Robertson said it was "absolutely our hope" that New Zealand will only be in level 3 for two weeks.

"The data is all heading in the right direction," he said.

He said many SMEs are under pressure right now, and the Government acknowledges this.

But the Government is providing a lot of support, such as the business loan scheme which he said is fully up and running.

Robertson said there was limited evidence to support any assertions that Australia is doing better under lockdown than New Zealand.

In fact, he pointed out that New Zealand is doing better than most other countries in the world, when it comes to responding to Covid-19.

"We will be well placed to rebound coming out of this."

"We are continually looking at what support we can provide [to businesses]," Robertson said.

He said more will be announced "over the coming weeks".

"I think we have the balance about right here," he said, in regards to the Government's business support.

The consequences for small businesses if New Zealand was to go back into level 4 would be far greater than the cost of staying in alert level 4 for a few extra days, Robertson said.

Asked how many small businesses have been able to get loans under the business loan scheme, Robertson said those numbers were not yet available.

He did, however, say it was in the thousands but Treasury were working to get the data as soon as possible.

Asked about a Government announcement about a rent relief announcement, Robertson said: "We're going to continue to work on that".

Minister of Employment Willie Jackson told the committee that when the Government inherited the economy, it was "sound".

However, there were some areas of the economy which were suffering.

When it comes to Maori unemployment, he said that number could double as a result of Covid-19.

But the Government was working hard to make sure that does not happen – for example, it has allocated more than $100 million towards redeployment.

He said Maori need as much support as possible right now – "we need a total resourcing of them".

Asked how much unemployment will rise as a result of the extended lockdown and the two weeks in level 3, Jackson was not able to say.

But he did admit that for each day New Zealand is in level 4, and subsequently level 3, unemployment will rise.

However, in the "overall scheme of things" the right decision has been made.

"It [the overall unemployment level] just depends on how much support the Government is going to bring to the table, which is going to be a lot," Jackson said.

"Another week is not trying to hurt or destroy anyone," Jackson said, in regards to spending another week in level 4.

However, he immediately withdrew these comments when challenged by National MP Todd McClay.

"There is obviously going to be pain for small businesses out there."

On the Government's wage subsidy scheme, which has paid out more than $10 billion so far, Jackson said there "hasn't been a huge abuse of the wage subsidy scheme".

MBIE officials said that so far more than 500 employers who have paid back the Government, after they wrongly received money from the Government.

Minister of Small Business Stuart Nash said the Government had "certainly turned the corner" when it comes to responding to Covid-19.

He said now was the time for businesses to get ready for level 3.

"We will never know what would happened if we did not act early," he said.

However, the predictions were then would be thousands of deaths and a sizable economic impact.

"The current lockdown is an incredibly hard for small businesses."

But he said the wage subsidy scheme has been a "life line" to small businesses.

Nash said the next step for the Government is looking into the recovery effort – "transitioning from survival, to recovery".

He added that he will be approaching some of the largest businesses in New Zealand and asking them to promise to pay their invoices to small businesses as quick as possible.

Asked how many businesses will be going bust because of the longer lockdown and the two weeks in level 3, Nash didn't say.

Instead, he said that taking the extra seven days to get it right will do a lot more to save the economy.

"The last thing we want to do is to go back into level 4," he said.

Pressed on how many businesses would go bankrupt, Nash still would not say.

National Leader Simon Bridges was critical of this, demanding information about how many businesses would go under as a result of the Government's decision.

Nash said it was Cabinet's opinion that if Covid-19 is eliminated, more small businesses would survive that what would have otherwise been the case.

Nash said level 3 was not an opening up of the economy to a pre-Covid-19 level, it was a "waiting room" to see if the Government has got the health measures right.

Nash said the Government has more announcements to make regarding support for businesses in the near future.

"Please don't think that what we have delivered so far is it," he said.

Nash said there was no chance of the Government reversing its decision to come out of level 4 on midnight on Monday.

"There are still many, many New Zealand workers who will still have to work from home under level 3."

But he said New Zealanders want the Government to get the health impact under control.
In the long run, that would be more beneficential for the economy as a whole, Nash said.

Asked for his advice for Small Businesses, Nash said: "Talk to your accountant".

If a small businesses does not have an accountant, "get in touch with the IRD".

Nash was unable to say how many businesses will be forced to close due to the level 4 and 3 restrictions.

"There are 495,000 businesses in this country – a number of them will come through this fine, a number of them won't."

He said the Government won't know until "we come out of this".

Nash said he and the Minister of Finance are still working on scheme which would help businesses with cash flow.

He said he was not ready to make an announcement about that today.

Asked about private sector roadblocks – whereby members of the public are preventing people from travelling – Nash said that was not appropriate.

"When people are trying to block main, arterial routes, that's not on," Nash, who is the Minister of Police, said.

National MP Gerry Brownlee said he had heard anecdotally that some gang members were stopping people from going to get milk.

Nash called these people "renegades" and their roadblocks are illegal.

The decision to extend the level 4 lockdown was one that Bridges, the committee's chairman, was critical of.

He said the Government should have done more while in lockdown to prevent the country from having to be in level 4 longer.

Speaking to media yesterday, he said his plan this week was to question the Government's economic Ministers about how much the extended lockdown period is expected to hit businesses.

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He will get that opportunity this morning.

"It's important we hear details about the plans in place to keep our small businesses afloat," Bridges said.

The committee will also question what plans there are to get people back into work if they have lost their job and what further government assistance will be available.

"The committee has been asking the questions New Zealanders want answers to," Bridges said.

We will continue to scrutinise the Government's response to ensure the response is the best it can be for all New Zealanders."

• Covid19.govt.nz: The Government's official Covid-19 advisory website