KEY POINTS:
Here is an earlier selection of Your Views:
Ian (Blenheim)
Destiny needs to gain strength and will identify the "enemy" and be this real or imaginary, it does draw the group together against the "threat." So let it be Muslims, Civil Unions, or the dreaded Helen Clark. Ho Hum. Off again against another dragon.
Brian basher
No one is right, it is not as simple as this. An idiot like Brian Tamaki to lead a procession of the so called 'righteous' is just silly. He is hiding behind this argument just to get more publicity, to get more bums on seats in his church. He is just brainwashing the naive and take ten per cent of their income for the privilege. The problem with the fundamentalists is that everything is black and white, nothing is gray, and life is not like that.
Dave (Auckland)
I am not a supporter of the self-appointed Brian Tamaki or his principles of recruiting predominantly Islanders or former down-and-outers. However, we will pay the price if we do not adopt some stand on the basic principles upon which this country was settled: Christianity.! If we allow all sorts of religious groups & ethnic minorities to tell us what we should & shouldn't do in NZ, then we will permit further rot. Try preaching Christianity or ideas that go against the government rulings/ laws/ thinking in many other countries (esp the Middle East) & see how long your 'freedom' lasts! We are so naive in NZ. If immigrants arrive in this country, they must respect our laws/rules/structure/education etc & realize they have no rights to tell us how this country should be run. No, I am not being racist or small-minded, just a realist. Ask the Brits what a little bit of leeway given to all sorts of religious/ ethnic minorities has led to in their once-proud nation...total chaos!
Kees
Bishop Brian stands up for what the majority of New Zealanders take for granted. I commend him for his stands, he is living by the word of God and ensuring that Gods laws remain. religious diversity means the national anthem must be changed, the laws and morals that our society is based on are based on the commandments in the bible, ( the Christian Bible) . What about prayer in the government house? What about swearing on the Bible? Yes other religions are present here in NZ , but NZ is a predominantly Christian nation. Remember, folks, that the media only portrays one view, one that is often twisted by own opinions and view points. Try attending a Destiny Church Service, and making up your own mind. Regardless of your religion, you can't deny there is something bigger than yourself, a statement of religious diversity means everybody loses out.
K
Westie, before you publish comments you should check your facts. Tithe is 10 per cent. Bishop Brian wouldn't burn anybody at a stake( who says that?) as Bishop Brian endeavors to ensure everybody knows and has the opportunity to hear the gospel, and know Jesus Christ. If you check the reasons he has protested it is because he is ensuring that the laws of God are abided by ( read your Bible and check up on the laws) notice that the protests are aimed at laws?
North Shore
Surprising as it may seem sometimes reading this feedback, New Zealand may not be a Christian nation but it is one that believes in God. A study in the Herald in January of '05, stated that 62 per cent of New Zealanders believe in God yet only 26 per cent regularly attend a church. It seems to me that the issue is that Churches are not relating to people any more. It is easy to sit on the sidelines and judge all Christianity by Brian Tamakis views, but the only man God says to look at is Jesus Christ, the only man without fault. Brian Tamaki is just a man, faulable as any of us are, but he is using his position to try to change his nation for what he believes. See through his personality and public profile and look at his heart. I'm really sick of hearing people refer to his followers as if they are drones, people make up their own minds. Just because they chose to get behind a man who can make public their concerns does not mean they have been brain washed. To say so would only demonstrates a level of ignorance that would be hypocritical given the view your suggesting.
Rewi Kemp
Nz's first gods were Melanesian/ Polynesian, Christianity is a modern imposition. All people must be permitted to believe in their gods so long as they do not try impose theirs upon others , or inferiorise the followers of other gods.What is important, is that no medieval fundamentalist such as "Bishop" Tamaki be permitted to force his self-serving medieval views upon the rest of us. Why are a third of NZ'ers atheist or agnostic? Because the more we see these ignorant, savage religious fundamentalists torture, murder & invade, the less we believe them.
Scott Sinclair
NZ is a secular nation and that's the way it should stay. Let's not confuse decent human values with Christianity (in my experience, the two seldom have anything in common). Our sense of right and wrong, justice, equality and fairness have been ingrained in us since time immemorial. It's Darwinism at it's best! For example, most of us know that, on the whole, it's wrong to take the life of another. We know this, not because we have Christian values, but because each of us has an inbuilt sense of right and wrong. We don't need a self-proclaimed bishop to tell us that because we have decent human values we must be Christian, thus, we're a Christian nation. We've managed to survive quite nicely these last 170 odd years being largely secular. Long may it continue.
Mike Feeney
NZ should absolutely not have a State religion; with so many varied belief systems spread across the population, including atheists like me, how could any nominated religion claim to represent all New Zealanders? Look around the world, at the States as one example where the religious right and their zealotry is every bit as dangerous as the "Islamic enemy" they fear so much. Bunch of --s, they should stop pushing their very narrow world view on to others.
N (Hauraki)
We are a Christian nation by simple majority or is it MMP? Our public holidays include Christmas and Easter, we have Christian churches in every community of our country, many people still marry in white wedding dresses, and white crosses mark the side of our roads where people have died. Maori religion/s and belief systems are intrinsic and organic to Aotearoa and should also be given the same acknowledgement and place in our society. Do other religions have a right to be here? Of course they do! Religious freedom was promised in the Maori version of the Treaty of Waitangi. What I would like to see is that any people coming into NZ are informed of, and are respectful toward, the beliefs, systems and religions of this country.
Paul
It would appear that Mr Tamaki is able to express a view on just about any subject that is likely to get him into the public eye...is destiny church a place of worship or a quasi political party? Surely religion is a thing of personal belief and whilst thousands of people have died in the name of a religious deity of one sort or another surely it is time to allow people to have a belief of their own choosing and not a state proclaimed one. Personally I hold a pagan view but would not dream of asking another person to have the same....show some religious tolerance New Zealand.
Paul (Auckland)
I don't agree with the Maori on many of their political positions, but this is one I wholeheartedly support. We are and always have been a Christian nation - missionaries brought Christianity to the Maori in the early 1800s, followed closely by the European settlers from England. Recent settlers who have brought other religions have been welcomed because we are a tolerant and open society, not because we have forsaken Christianity. Once again this totalitarian and ploitically correct Labour government is trying to tell the people what to think and it should be rejected in favour of the people's voice.
Persian guy
I am an Iranian-New Zealander and my message to all fellow kiwis is that religion and politics don't mix. I was raised in a Muslim family but don't care about religion and think that every one has the right to choose his ideology freely, as long as it does not interfere with society and law. Let me tell you... I have seen firsthand the devastating effects that a religious oriented government (Iran) has on people. It's horrible and the past 30 yrs experience of an Islamic government in Iran has backfired on religious values and the Iranian society is losing its family values all because of forcing people to practice the religious orders.You guys may forget to appreciate the fact that New Zealand is a free and democratic country because of the separation of church and state.
Ben
NZ might have been founded, as a state, by people that were predominantly Christian, but that was a long time ago and we have moved on as a nation. 35 per cent of New Zealand explicitly states that they have no religious beliefs (2006 Census, www.stats.govt.nz), and the percentage attending church or w/e weekly is between 10-15 per cent. How many MPs, politicians or important people openly and regularly profess faith in Christianity? Hardly any, because people do not care, or want such leaders.This isn't America, and we don't want public, explicit recognition of Christianity.
Jenny (Auckland)
Of course we have a state religion - it's not compulsory, but it's what our laws/morals are based on - and yes - shock horror - it's Christianity.
KiwiBoy
Am i the only one, but why does everything Bishop Tamaki say come across in the wrong spirit? Also why does nearly everything he claim, run counter to the scriptures in the Bible? Of which he is supposed to be an authority on? If the greatest commandment is that you love one another; Why does the Bishop and his followers act in hate, anger, malice and breed strife? If God offers man the right of free choice to accept his will, Why does the Bishop insist on a state religion? Bishop seems to forget "that all have sinned and come short the glory of god" not just non-Christians! Bishop, if ye be without sin, only then cast that stone in your hand!
Bruce
On this one, Tamaki is spot one. I finished reading Eve Bites (Ian Wishart) over the weekend and reading through these Posts the points raised in the book are reflected loud and clear in many of the posts here. New Zealand's law, justice, society and even the Treaty of Waitangi is based on Christian values and associations. If we as a country are not prepared to acknowledge and fight for that, then clearly we as a country aren't prepared to fight for anything. I can see why people are saying the West as we know it today will be gone in 50-years time.
Richard
First we have to determine, what being a "Christian nation" means. Christianity as preached by Christ and His apostles means turning your back on what the carnal world has to offer, and becoming spiritually minded. Materialism, rugby world cups, America cups mean nothing to a Christian as defined in the New Testament. Conforming your life to the life of Christ is all that matters. I haven't met one person in New Zealand who lives up to that standard. Therefore we should be honest and call ourselves a godless nation.
Dennis Sosnoski
I completely back Brian Tamaki's call not to "defile" New Zealand's soil with "foreign religions". Christianity and all the other Pakeha religions should be immediately banned.
JG
Xenophobic morons. By what right does the self styled, "Bishop" represent our nation to the world as a bigoted and xenophobic people? NZ has always been a place of religious tolerance, we don't make note of whether our neighbours go to church, temple or sunbathe on a Sunday. Christianity on show this way is just that, a show. Destiny isn't a church, it's a cult. True Christians keep their faith between themselves and their God and don't try to pound others with it or force them to conform to someone else's vision of Religion.
Brad (Auckland)
Another shining example of Brian "Bishop of Bull Tamaki grabbing the opportunity to bask in the limelight by taking a ridiculously radical stance on an issue that gets him some media coverage, in the hope that the bigoted and weak-minded amongst us will be brainwashed into helping to fill his bank account more swiftly.New Zealand was founded on the system of British law, not on Christianity. If people want to believe in fairy-tales and myths, fine, go for it. But dont go shoving it down everyone elses throat by trying to tell us that New Zealand is a "Christian Nation", because that's quite obviously just another pathetic attempt by the religious right to force their "faith" on the rest of us. New Zealand is to religion what Switzerland is to politics, completely neutral and it should stay that way. Instead, these small-minded religious leaders are trying to drive a wedge into our society by instilling an "us vs them" mentality in their followers, which will lead to only one outcome: Religious Extremism. And the current situation in the Middle East shows us exactly where that leads.
Andy
While reading Your Views, one of the unfortunate consequences of this story becomes apparent to me. That Christianity and all Christians are tarred with the same brush as this sad little man. While I am not a Christian myself I respect the right of all people to practise whichever religion they choose. While it is valid to site Iran and other hard-line Islamic states, we should also remember that Christianity has it's own history of state sanctioned religious persecution. The Catholic church with its persecution of scientists and anyone else who dared to suggest that the earth was not the centre of the universe. And the Church of England was hardly a model of tolerance and understanding in its early years. But we as humans evolved, and Christianity(in general) evolved with us.When a child throwing a tantrum loses his audience, he loses interest in the tantrum. Brian Tamaki is only dangerous if we take him seriously. If we treat him as the joke he is, the tantrum will lose its appeal.New Zealand does not and should not have a state religion, we do have a majority religion, but our country is made up of that and all the faiths and beliefs that have been brought to our shores for centuries. It would be a tragic day if we ever lost that diversity.
Garnet
Tamaki is correct that we are a Christian nation. We are bound by the covenants subscribed by our forefathers in the three kingdoms in the seventeenth century. We are a Christian country because we have been bound by our forebears just as we recognise that we who are the posterity of those who signed the treaty of Waitangi are still bound by it today. We cannot dismiss our lineage as a nation and we still recognise both the Crown of England and the Lordship of Jesus Christ by the prayer by the speaker said before each sitting of Parliament. See covenantedreformation.com for more proof.
Gooch
If the state of New Zealand needs an official religion, why stop there? Surely we could have an official softdrink too.This is an L&P country. It's our heritage. Of course we accept people who want to drink coke etc, but really they should be trying to integrate.
Alwin
The term religion is a very broad one and abused one. One does not have to be a Christian to be religious in this modern worlds terms.Anybody can claim to belong to a religion, but this does not make them a Christian (Follower of Christ). In fact Christ himself disliked the religious leaders of His day. NZ was founded on Christian principles and for this reason I would like NZ to be a Christian Country.
Karl Rohde
The state must remain secular. There is no place in New Zealand for a non-secular orientated government. Mr Tamaki's (I refuse to use his self-appointed title) belief that (his form of) Christianity is the primary religion of NZ is ludicrous. Yes, our law begun as Judaeo-Christian based, but our strong case based justice system has evolved to represent all facets of society. Mr Tamaki's views are very dangerous, and smack of another radical belief system. Nazi Fascism. He must be watched, and closely. He is like that blemish that could possibly be cancer that you don't want to acknowledge until it is too late. By the way, I have no religion other that belief in one's self. People like Tamaki seem to think that is wrong or evil, but then, they don't make money out of people like me. Oh, and one more thing... those Christian people chucking stones regarding the civil liberties of women within other religions should check their history and facts. Christianity does not exactly have a good track record of equal gender rights, and even today, sadly lacks equality. Nor do they have a good track record with persecution, war, and sedition within nations that are secular or many other "points" they use to justify "their one true religion".
Mike (Remuera)
Just ignore that sanctimonious --. Tamaki has as much right to claim to be a bishop as a burger flipper at Mcdonalds has a right to claim to be a chef, or the kids on Shortland street claiming to be actors!
Geoff (CHCH)
We're way better off not getting into a debate with Brian, he is doing what great promoters always do - creating publicity. The more of us complain about his ignorance the more publicity he gets and the more people join his church and the more money he makes. You won't see him driving around in a beat up HQ - he spends the money of giving, trusting people on personal indulgance. We are better off waking up to the Destiny of Brian. A rich and prosperous retirement.
Brian
With the world still at war down religious lines after thousands of years, it seems to me a pretty good idea for New Zealand to demonstrate that we show no religious bias, and make all religions equal. Those that want to believe can still believe what they like, but it does not have to be part of our country's identity.
Ben (Auckland)
Another winner from Tamaki! what a great idea lets have a state sanctioned religion and lets form a new state body to oversee it and ensure everyone believes what they 'should'. I am a Christian but I find this just stupid, NZ is a better place for certain freedoms and this is one of those.
Bishop Simon, Christchurch... yeah right
Whoever thinks NZ would adopt a state religion is extremely naive. Claiming authority from god (or the tooth fairy) is a pathetic way of trying to bolster ideas and prejudices that cannot stack up on their own merit. Unfortunately, when god is on your side, everyone who disagrees with you is automatically and absolutely wrong... that's why the bish is incapable of real dialogue. It probably also explains why he doesn't realise what a complete joke most New Zealanders think he is.
Daniel
Religion is a personal choice, not the state of a nation.
vitamin_k (Auckland)
Brian Tamaki should brush up on his own heritage. Before the Europeans arrived in New Zealand, they too were foreigners bringing Christian missionaries whose beliefs were foreign to our indigenous people. Based on his own logic he must agree that Christianity is a foreign religion which is defiling our soil and convert to traditional Maori beliefs.
Bennet
New Zealand is made for immigration. People from all over the world with different characteristics and different tastes. If New Zealand becomes a Christian only religious state then New Zealand's income from immigration and tourist attraction will go down because this is another element to racism. We should not restrict other religions just because the majority of NZ's population are Christians. Brian Tamaki may have a right to say his views but he has no right to encourage other people to hate towards another religion just because he is not one of them.
Disillusioned ex-Anglican
I come from a traditional Anglican background a legacy handed down from my parents, grandparents all the way back to Adam. That Reverend Moxon who is siding with Helen Clare doesnot represent the thinking of a lot of Anglicans especially Maori. I for one will be defecting this church with my family and join Brian Tamakis Church.At least he is consistent. So come on you Anglicans who dont agree with what Helen Clark is suggesting. Time to leave the Anglican Church. Find some church who is not going to dismantle what God has put in place. Go National.
Sean Kelly
As an athiest I do not see the point in why any nation needs to declare that it and its people belong to any religion.NZ as a country just needs to demonstrate that our beliefs are not in some made up myths but to be believers of themselves.We do not need Gods to ask everything for. We just need to ask ourselves what we really want and to make it happen ourselves. That is how true happiness and success in aspired to.
Philip
While it is foolish to try to ignore the Christian heritage of this nation, to insist that the nation should have a state religion is no better. I am Christian and I migrated from India, which though in spite of having a predominantly Hindu population is still secular. Bishop Tamaki protests do more harm than good to Christianity. Let him preach the gospel instead of such protests.
Andrew
I am not a Christian (technically I'm a NZ European athiest :)), But saying we have no "state" religion is like saying Maori were not here before Europeans. We honour Maori as out Native people, and rightly so.So then why don't we Honour the Christian World view that dominates our early heritage, laws and development. Having a National Religion does not mean we all must conform to it, But acknowledges where we came from. Ah, the joys of a democratic society...Democracy, The style of leadership that convinces the 'Minions' that they have power or their opinion 'matters'....Tamaki is a maniac, But sometimes, however seldom, he is right!
Andrew(Whangarei)
Mr Tamaki obviously lacks confidence in his own faith if he consistently seeks state endorsement.Perhaps, its concern for his church's bottom line, rather than religion, that drives his latest (extremely well publicised) campaign.
Gerald
Tamaki is a clown with a team of clowns in black who don't appear to have jobs but have plenty of time to bounce around the country putting on their shows.Each to their own I say and the media should stop giving king of all clowns Brian Tamaki any coverage.It is a free country last I heard and we don't need Christian views shoved down our throats.We should be open to all religions not just Christianaty for our sanity.
Cate
If NZ does not have a state religion, this leaves it wide open for some religeous sect to see that we need one. Then we might just get one thrust upon us that we don't like. Get my drift?
Richard
This debate is just another government ruse. Is anyone aware that the government have just sold away the mining rights to the ironsands on the west coast to the Chinese? What else is going on in the background while you are debating smacking, religion etc?
Thilal
There are official languages in many countries because it brings everybody to work on a common platform and ease work for everybody, particularly for bureaucrats. What 'more' benefits, if at all there are, you get from making a religion official? Nothing, but more conflicts. Religions need not be 'nationalized' leave it alone for the people who believe it. Is there any clear evidence that a country prospers better with an official religion while others do not? Rather so called fundamentalists or religious fanatics have destroyed more humans, animals and assets than non-believers or atheists. All the religions we get today are at least a millennium old. They don't work anymore!! None of them have solutions for today's complex social and technical problems. It is what we as humans find with our contemporary cognition that matters in problem solving. Those who want to politicize and commercialize religions are doing it for their own gains nothing more.
Maree (Auckland)
God of Nations, at thy feet. In the bonds of love we meet&.Is Helen Clark going to abolish the national anthem next?
Jame King
I am sad to see that this great country that I myself came to make a life for my family and this man make a point that there should not be another religion but his, how can a so called man of god that relieves the poor of their money to fund his life style and his family. God created us all and maybe that people have different views to whom they pray too, but in the eyes of God we are his children what ever skin or country we come from, he himself has to understand that we are not stupid to let a person like that brain wash us to be so narrow minded. He in my opinion has no right to speak the world of god to any one but then he did not live like a millionaire
DC
Yet again, religion causing more arguments!! Has anyone stopped to think that religion has been behind most of wars in this world?
Christian guy (Auckland)
I'm Christian and because of my belief, I wouldn't dare to impose those beliefs on someone else. We as a country are as diverse as beauty can be. Thus to have a state religion would be utterly contrary to the truth that shall make us free.
Optimus Prime
Politics and religion don't mix. We all know that dictator Brian Tamaki is trying to get his foot into Parliament. Brian in the words of the Bible "thou shall not judge". Focus on your preaching's not on becoming a bigger dick then you already are. Power corrupts and indeed you are corrupted by your rise. I have seen your halls...no pictures the Father the son or the Holy Spirit. It's all focused on you?.Remember the 10 commandments: Thou shalt not make for yourself an idol Thou shalt not make wrongful use of the name of your God....this is the word of the lord. NZL to be religion free as it is already labelled Godzone.
Which god to go with
I don't believe in any god Christian or otherwise. My reason, too many wars have been fought through the centuries in the name of one god or another, too much wealth accumulated and placed in the coffers of those at the top of the tree, and too much prejudice has, and continues to be spread, by those who firmly believe that their god and their religion is the one true belief that everyone else should aspire to or else they are in the wrong. Religious bigotry such as portrayed by the followers of the self named Bishop Tamaki, who personally does very nicely thank you from the proceeds that he expects his followers to put in his coffers on a weekly basis, disgust decent minded people. Zealots are at best irritating people, and at worst, dangerous. A person's beliefs are their own and in a democrary we are free to choose which path we follow. May this always be the case, and may the state remain out of religion.
Danny
The separation of religion and state is a cornerstone of democratic society. In Turkey, a country that is 99 per cent Muslim, people have been protesting against moves by their government to introduce Islamic recognition despite their country having stronger ties to a singular religion than we do in New Zealand. The people of Turkey appear to be more advanced thinkers than we are here in New Zealand! It seems many New Zealanders have forgotten the importance of their right to live in a secular state.
Observer
I am an NZ Christian living in a conservative Muslim nation. I think Tamaki is trying to point out how our liberal, PC, minority-driven policies waters down our national identity. In this country, if you aint Muslim, hard luck, they aren't gig ot of their way to build you churches or bow down to whatever special treatment you think you deserve. I like the attitude. New Zealand needs to stand for something!
Robert
Why must we constantly pander to those who persist in believing in something that can neither be prooved and, on balance of evidence, most probably does not exist? If people decide to deny rationality and reason and believe in the bronze age mythology that is Christianity, that is their choice. But as a rational person, I choose not to believe such unsubstantiated beliefs and resent those self-righteous bigots who think they can ram it down our throats.
Whilst I cannot prove that God does not exist, I am satisified that the evidence overwhelmingly suggests that this is the case. I will respect someone's Christian beliefs (and Jewish or Muslim beliefs too) but only to the same extent that I respect the beliefs of those